Reading Schedule, Part II

Dear All,

I think most of us can benefit from a little time to catch up, so let's extend the end of Part I through next Monday. For Part II, here is the schedule:

Monday, November 7: Read through the end of Section V of Part II.
Monday, November 14: Read through the end of Section X of Part II.
Monday, November 21: Read through the end of Part II (this is just two shorter sections, so we will have a little break).

Cheers all!

Myshkin and Ganya. Ganya and Myshkin. I think I prefer Ganya.

I’m again behind schedule, but better late than never! :)

So many emotions regarding the last sections of Part I. I think I’ll just rant, if you don’t mind.

First of all, what is NF’s problem?! Why does she come to Ganya’s house and disrespect his mother and sister? I don’t care what she wants to do with her own life, how she wants to punish *herself*, but that kind of behavior toward these poor women is completely uncalled for. She may want to give Ganya a taste of what life with her will be like, she may want to push him to the limit and see how much he can take (or how low he can go), she may be curious to see if he will stand up for her in front of his relatives—whatever! Whatever he reasons, her behavior was still despicable. I feel like the tortured, beautiful, thoughtful, self-destructive and emotional woman Dostoyevsky is describing when talking ABOUT her is not who he is portraying when she actually gets to talk and act.

Ganya… is a confusing character too. Everyone is confusing, I guess, and that’s why I liked this book so much to begin with, and wanted to discuss it with you. When NF shows up at his house and starts her bitchiness, the author says that Ganya had: “поклявшийся всеми клятвами больно наверстать ей всё это впоследствии и в то же время ребячески мечтавший иногда про себя свести концы и примирить все противоположности” [he made every promise to painfully pay her back for this in the future, and at the same time he was boyishly hoping to himself to bring all ends together and to reconcile all the opposites]. This is what I would call being truly “childlike”—hoping beyond all hope to make things work out, even when the adult mind would give up the matter for a lost cause. I guess the adult viewpoint predominates in Ganya, but he still has a little of this childlike hope left, which makes him a more appealing person despite all those terrible descriptions of him. Later on, Myshkin also recognizes this childlike quality in him, but I will come back to that conversation in a little bit.

As Katia mentioned, there seems to be some kind familiarity between Rogozhin and Ganya. I don’t think there is any specific mention of them being friends outside of that time when they gambled together, but the way Rogozhin talks about Ganya and his money-grubbing ways, it is as if Rogozhin knows Ganya’s personality closely. Rogozhin immediately says that Ganya will crawl to Vasilievsky (bridge, I assume?) to get three rubles, and soon after confidently says that he can easily buy Ganya out, because Ganya has such a money-loving soul. Why, why does he feel like he can offend a person like that? I suppose Ganya deserved this kind of treatment because he agreed to marry a woman for a financial reward. And yet… in front of Ganya’s mother and sister? What kind of people are these? I’m not sure what the author meant to portray, but Ganya does not by far seem like the lowliest person in the room.

And now, one of the moments which were completely shocking to me—when Myshkin was the one who stopped Ganya from hitting his sister. Initially, it was so dramatic and impressive—the only MAN in the room who was MAN ENOUGH to realize what’s happening and to stop it, was this Myshkin—little mouse. For a second I thought—maybe this is the lion side of him coming out! But no, the author immediately brings him down, put him in the corner (practically crying, I bet), all pathetic after Ganya slaps him. Maybe this is supposed to be Christ-like, to offer the other cheek, to be meek? And why does he say that phrase “Oh, how you will be ashamed of your action!” So melodramatic. Doesn’t quite go together with the manly image projected a minute ago.

In any case, this is a surprising side of Myshkin coming out—he is decisive, not afraid, a protector. Who would have thought? Will it appear again?

Later, when Ganya comes to ask for an apology, Myshkin is once again surprising, but in a bad way this time. First of all, he says “I did not think at all that you are this kind of person!” Meaning that he *can make mistakes in judging people,* and we probably should not forget this. It is so tempting to think he is this incredibly perceptive person who is practically from a different world. I think what Ganya says in response to that phrase is very telling: “What, [you are surprised] that I can admit my guilt?.. And why did I think before that you are an idiot! You notice things that other people never would. One could talk to you… but, better not to!”

One little side note from their following conversation. At one point, Myshkin says “I think this happens all the time: a man marries for money, but all the money is in the wife’s hands.” When I read that, I thought: how the hell does he know? Didn’t he grow up an idiot, in some Swiss village? Isn’t he unaware of the ways of the world? Maybe it’s from books. But still, his insight is a little suspicious. Like maybe the author slipped up and made him *too* wise for his background.

Coming back to the heart-to-heart between Myshkin and Ganya. What did you think of the moment when he said “Теперь я вижу, что вас не только за злодея, но и за слишком испорченного человека считать нельзя. Вы, по-моему, просто самый обыкновенный человек, какой только может быть, разве только что слабый очень и нисколько не оригинальный.” [Now I see that you are not only not a villain, you cannot even be considered a particularly corrupt person. I think you are simply the most regular person that can be, except maybe very weak and completely unoriginal.”

If I may express my opinion about this frankly (and pardon my French):

WTF?!!???!!?!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Either Myshkin с луны свалился (is from a different planet), or he is stupid in human relations (which goes against prior evidence), or he is getting REVENGE on Ganya. What happened to his fine-tuned psychology? He must know that he is hitting Ganya where it really hurts. I mean, who would like to hear that about him/herself? If someone said that to me… I would not be cool about it. Anyway, my conclusion is that Myshkin is clever and getting his revenge on Ganya. He is not some little lamb, by far. Ganya may be right—even though Myshkin gives off an inviting aura for people to talk to him, it may be best not to.

Gosh. I could go on, but for the remaining section of Part I, maybe I will post a separate post. Also for laughter (but that will be short). And a new reading schedule.

My response to Part 1 (Katia)

Again, a few general thoughts.

• How do Rogozhin and Gania know each other? When Rogozhin storms into his house with his crew, he calls him Gan'ka and shows a great deal of familiarity towards him. In the beginning (chapter 10), Ganya pretends not to recognize him, but Rogozhin immediately makes fun of him for it and says that just a few months ago he lost to Ganya in a card game. Is Ganya the one who introduced Rogozhin to Nastasia Filipovna? I recall vaguely seeing evidence for that somewhere else. I get the feeling that their relationship may be important because when Kolya and Myshkin talk after the scene with Rogozhin and N.F., Kolya criticizes Rogozhin, saying "you can't behave like that in the house of your..."--and then he changes the subject. Was he just going to say "enemy" or a closer connection?
• Ganya's main motivation and flaw is his pride. When he describes to the prince how he would make N. F. behave (chapter 10), he says, "I don't want to be funny; above all else, I don't want to be funny." That is essentially why he doesn't rush into the flames to save the thousand rubles that N. F. grants him. His love of himself and his image is greater than his love for money. There's something about him that reminds me of the Underground Man and Raskolnik--poor, with family problems, they dream of being great men, but don't know the right way of going about it. They want it all now and want to "skip," as Ganya says, the process. Although, unlike the other two, Ganya doesn't seem to have a gnawing and contradictory self-criticism.
• Another connection with "Crime and Punishment" is the family of General Ivolgin's mistress Terentieva, which is remarkably similar to the Marmeladovs. There are two daughters and a son, as well as an older sibling, Ippolit (although in Marmeladov's family that sibling, Sonia, is one of the two daughters, I think); the mother is sick; the father is a stepfather, a penitent yet constant drunkard who spends all the family's small income on alcohol and never shows up at home unless he needs cash, although he used to have a good job. And like Raskolnikov, Myshkin is like a guide to him. I suppose that's why the general says so frequently, "General Ivolgin and Prince Myshkin!", as if it were the headline of a performance (and their behavior is often taken and described as a comedy).
• A general theme that I'd like to track in the second part is the role of money. We've heard it mentioned from the very beginning during the train ride, when Rogozhin told the prince about his inheritance. Then when Myshkin visits the Epanchins, everyone thinks that he wants money. Money is also the reason why Ganya is willing to marry N. F. and money is Afanasi Ivanovich's main method of controlling her--either forcing her into sex or getting her out of his life by paying Ganya to marry her. Men like Rogozhin and General Epanchin also try to impress N. F. with fancy gifts, but she learns to manipulate them through money as well--by making light of their gifts, by coming to Petersburg and threatening Afanasi Ivanovich to maintain her or she'll dishonor him, by refusing to be "traded" (a word that's often used in the book) as a commodity between him, Ganya, and Epanchin, and finally by throwing the 1,000 rubles into the fire, thus maddening everyone and shaming Ganya with her challenge. Money will also play a big role in the prince's life now that we know he too is set to receive a large inheritance. And money is very important to General Ivolgin as an alcoholic and provider to the Terentievs. I think the main conclusion we can draw from all of this is that money has no positive value in the book. It facilitates exploitation, addiction, impoverishment, arrogance, and insanity (although Myshkin, the one whom everyone considers insane, doesn't care about money). Even for N. F., it has no real significance. Perhaps it did when she was younger and had no choice but to accept A. I's advances, but that's not why she installs herself in Petersburg. That's not why she tells Rogozhin to bring her 1,000 rubles and then "chooses" him. For her, the ultimate goal seems to be revenge, both against A. I. and, strangely enough, against herself. 

By the way, what's the reading schedule for Part II? Is it as before, read through ch. V by next Monday?